Rule number 6 does not follow the LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol. Rule 13 is a rule that can kill elections in LULAC, at the state and at national level. Rule was used in the national convention in Las Vegas to deny the counting of votes.
Rule number 6 does not follow the LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol. Rule 13 is a rule that can kill elections in LULAC, at the state and at national level. Rule was used in the national convention in Las Vegas to deny the counting of votes.
Rule number 6 does not follow the LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol. Rule 13 is a rule that can kill elections in LULAC, at the state and at national level. Rule was used in the national convention in Las Vegas to deny the counting of votes.
The Editor: The Editor will share with you the problems with Rule 6
and 13 in the proposed Rules for the Texas LULAC Convention to be
held June 4 through June 8, 2014. The Texas LULAC General Assembly meets on Sunday, June 8, 2014 to vote for officers for Texas LULAC. Rule 6 Rule number 6 does not follow the LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol (hereinafter referred to as the LULAC Constitution or constitution). The LULAC Constitution states: Rule 6 reads- Elections shall be by stand up vote and if election is too close to call a stand up row by row count will be taken. The Election Judge shall repeat the vote to the floor. The Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol of LULAC under Article VIII, National Officers, Section 5, Election of National Officers, subsection d. states: Voting in National elections shall by roll call, a show of hands, or secret ballot, as the Rules Committee may recommend and the National Assembly may approve. A vote by a show of hands would be within the Constitution. The interpretation of the wording of the Constitution is pretty elementary. This rule, while being unconstitutional, does not kill an election in LULAC. It does however set up another example of the LULAC Board, at state and at national, legislating rules that are not in the LULAC charter or the LULAC Constitution. Rule 13 Rule 13 is a rule that can kill elections in LULAC, at the state and at the national level, since, as it turns out, is the same rule that is being used in California, National and now Texas, for the 2014 conventions. Rule 13 states: Challenges to any election must be issued to the State Legal Advisor immediately after the outcome is announced and before another election has begun. It shall take, as per Roberts Rules of Order (revised), a two-thirds vote to overturn all rulings made by the State Legal Advisor. This rule was used in the national convention in Las Vegas to deny the counting of votes in one of the votes taken at the convention. Roger Rocha Explains How a Rule 13 is Used to Deny a Counting of Delegate Votes Roger Rocha explained how the rule is used in LULAC during a deposition type examination conducted in the LULAC case in Arizona known as Soto, et al v. LULAC, et al. The examination was being conducted by Anthony Guajardo, the LULAC attorney in that case: 7 Q. Direct your attention to paragraph 12 of 8 Exhibit 14, again.
9 A. Yes, sir.
10 Q. And would you read that for the Court, please.
11 A. Yes, sir. [As read] Challenges to any election
12 must be issued to the national legal advisor immediately
13 upon the outcome -- after the outcome is announced and
14 before another election has begun. It shall take
15 two-thirds to overturn -- two-thirds vote to overturn any
16 ruling made by the national legal advisor.
Q. Is there a procedure whereby someone who disagrees with the -- the outcome of the election or that they saw the election differently, for them to call for -- or make a motion for -- or roll call vote?
A. No. That -- that's -- that type of a motion would be out of the order.
Q. So what would be the proper way to challenge the election, if it was supposedly close or they disagreed with the counters?
A. Sure. Specifically the way -- line item, what I just read. That is the procedure. If you look at the second -- if you look at that paragraph, any candidate that wants to challenge an election has to go to the national legal advisor. The national legal advisor will render his opinion whether to uphold or deny a recount. If --
Q. And was the national legal advisor present with you --
A. Yes, sir, that is correct, he was.
Q. And who was that, sir?
A. It is the gentleman sitting next to you, Mr. Escobar.
Q. Mr. Escobar. And how far away were you sitting from -- from where --
A. He was sitting approximately -- there was one individual next to me and he was immediately after that individual.
Q. And did he remain on the stage next to you the entire time during the election?
A. Yes, sir, he did.
Q. Did anyone approach or ask Mr. Escobar for a legal opinion because there were challenging any of the election process, either the election result or any other part of the --
A. There was one who was a candidate that ran for national president that asked that -- the election -- she challenged the election, and that was Ms. Mary Ramos.
Q. She challenged the election against because she was running for national president against Margaret Moran; correct?
A. That is correct.
Q. And was that a proper challenge? Did she -- what -- what did she tell you, I'm challenging?
A. She wanted a challenge vote. And I directed her that she needed to go to the legal advisor.
Q. And did she, in fact, do that?
A. She went. She was denied.
Q. Did -- then what happened after that?
A. After that, she got off stage.
Q. Okay. She didn't ask for the National Assembly?
A. No, sir. To get the Election Judge to take the vote by calling the roll or by taking a head count of how each delegate is voting, Rule 13 requires that the challenger, that is, the person who is requesting the count, to state that the person challenges the call of the vote by the Election Judge. The Election Judge would turn to the Legal Advisor and inform the Legal Advisor that there is a challenge to the call of the vote by the Election Judge, which would at that point be converted to a challenge to the Legal Advisor. The Election Judge would then ask the legal Advisor how he saw the vote. The Legal Advisor is going to go along with the Election Judge and would announce that the challenge would be considered a challenge to the Legal Advisor. The Election Judge would again call for a vote on the challenge informing the delegates that it would take a 2/3rds vote to over-ride the opinion of the Legal Advisor. The vote needed to defeat a head count of the delegates would be any number of delegates above 1/3 rd of the assembly. The vote needed to obtain a head count of the delegates would be any number of delegates above 2/3rds of the assembly. Rule 13 is beset by a myriad of problems, first is the legal advisors expanded role in LULAC elections
The Illegal Expanded Role of the Legal Advisor
The legal advisors role in LULAC is described in Article VIII, National Officers, Section 9, Duties and Responsibilities of the National Officers, g. Legal Advisor:
(1) To represent the League in all legal matters in which it may be involved or have an interest;
(2) To interpret and render an opinion on matters arising with regard to the LULAC Constitution and Bylaws, Resolutions and/or Policies when requested by any member, Council, or officer of the League. The National Assembly may by a two-thirds majority reverse an opinion of the Legal Advisor in those cases wherein it is believed that he/she has acted in a biased manner or contrary to the spirit of the provision in question;
(3) To cooperate with the National Secretary in preparing and maintaining up to date the volume which contains all resolutions, amendments, policies duly adopted and in force;
(4) To counsel with Legal Advisors of subordinate entities, including LULAC Youth, as requested.
The LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol have a limited role for the Legal Advisor in LULAC. Nowhere in the LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol is additional authority granted to the Legal Advisor.
To expand the role of the legal advisor in LULAC elections should be written into the LULAC Constitution by amending the LULAC Constitution. The 2/3rds Vote to Get to Count the Votes of Degelates The second major problem is the 2/3rds requirement that a delegate seeking a head count of the vote needs to have on a motion for a count of the votes, a division of the house, challenging the legal advisor. The call for a division of the house is the traditional way that delegates get to request a count of the votes when elections are too close to call. The United States Congress has this provision in Article I, Section 5, Clause 3, Each House shall keep a Journal of its Proceedings, and from time to time publish the same, excepting such Parts as may in their Judgment require Secrecy; and the Yeas and Nays of the Members of either House on any question shall, at the desire of one fifth of those present, be entered on the Journal. Democratic institutions see this rule as equalizing power sharing in its institutions. The majority normally never fears having its vote challenged. Most organizations require nothing more than a request made by a member for a count of the vote. Seconds are not called for. There is no debate and no amendments to the vote on whether the assembly will have a count of the vote. Roberts Rules of Order state that in institutions where no rules are written into the organizations constitution, bylaws of charter, that the unwritten rule would be a motion, a second, no debate and no amendments, then the vote is taken and a simple majority is all that is needed to get a count on the issue at hand, that is, a vote on a resolution or on candidates for an election to a post. The Legislation of Rules for LULAC Writing rules that are not contained in the LULAC charter or its Constitution is know in legal jargoneese as legislating by a body within an organization that is not empowered to amend the constitution or its charter or its bylaws. In LULAC all changes to the Constitution is reserved to the LULAC Assembly, not to its Board of Directors or to its Executive Committee. The Rules Committee is a lesser body in LULAC. It cannot create rules that go outside of the LULAC Charter or the LULAC Constitution. As a rule, the Rules Committee could limit the vote to be taken by having the delegates show hands to indicate support for or against a resolution of for any of two or more candidates running for office. The Rules Committee is legislating a rule when its states as a rule that voting will be by standing. The LULAC Charter and its Constitution does not state this as one of its three methods of voting. In Rule 13, the Rules Committee in again legislating when it creates a role for the Legal Advisor t be involved in calling the outcome of an election. Here the Rules committee and the Board are legislating by going outside the LULAC Charter and its Constitution. They are creating language that is not found in the LULAC Constitution. It is further legislating when they requiresa 2/3rds vote to overcome the call of an election. Calling the outcome of an election is not a legal opinion and if it was so, it should not require a 2/3rds vote to limit the counting of a vote on a matter that only requires a simple majority of the vote to pass, if its a resolution, or get elected, if its in electing officers of LULAC. The LULAC Constitution states in the clearest language that: The LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol says at Article VIII, National officers, Section 1, Elective Officers: The following positions will be filled by majority vote of the General Assembly. The list includes the President, the VPs and the Treasurer.
Again in:
Section 5 of the same Article VIII, states in c. All elective National Officers, with the exception of State Directors who are elected by their respective State Assemblies, shall be elected by a majority vote of the accredited delegates to the national Assembly. The LULAC Constitution, Bylaws and Protocol state that its officers are elected by simple majority vote. Its says nothing on how LULACers get to get a count of the vote. For that provision and that right, one goes to Roberts Rules of Order. LULAC is deeply ingrained with Roberts Rules of Order. One would ask, why Roberts Rules of Order and when does it come into play? The Arizona transcript provides the role that Roberts Rules of Order play in LULAC. The person being examined is Manuel Escobar, LULACs Legal Advisor, on questioning by its attorney Anthony Guajardo: From the Arizona transcript on cross by LULAC attorney Guajardo to Manuel Escobar (witness):
Q. All right. Is Robert -- Robert's Rules of Order followed in LULAC business?
A. First, the constitution is followed. Then the rules of the convention are followed and then the I believe the rules of the convention actually provide that if the rules don't address a particular matter, then that matter is covered by Robert's Rules of Order. In matters of parliamentary procedure, LULACers go to Roberts Rules of Order when a procedure is not found in the LULAC Constitution. Rule 13 is an illegal rule. The rule illegally creates a role for the Legal Advisor in LULAC elections. The rule then illegally creates a super majority standard to challenge the outcome of a LULAC vote.