Opuscoli 5

Paul De Angelis
Intervista a Leonora
Carrington
Gli opuscoli di Omar Wisyam
Volume n. 5
Intervista a Leonora Carrington
De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 2

Nunca me considere una “femme - enfant”

como André Breton quería ver a las mujeres.
Ni siquiera que me tuvieran por una, ni traté
de cambiar al resto, sencillamente aterricé en
el surrealismo; nunca pregunté si tenia
derecho a entrar.
Leonora Carrington
Paul De Angelis - What worries you

today?
Leonora Carrington - Above all, the

idea of death, the fact that I'm old and
our attitude to death is totally
erroneous.
In reality we know very little about
death, but if we know that a series of
worlds exist that appear to be

transforming.
Paul- Worlds more there than life?
Leonora- Yes, we distinguish life

from death, but in my opinion things
are not how they are explained to us. I
believe that they are different for each
person, like dreams. I think that to
reach an understanding about death
first we must understand the distinct
places that exist within us, and
dreams are one of these places; this is
to say that The Paul and the Leonora
of a dream are in a way a different
Paul and Leonora. It almost appears
to be like worlds in reverse. It seems
that we have a body which unfolds
activities, meanwhile our physical
body remains inactive when we are

asleep; with our bodies we do things,

we go to places, drive cars, ride bikes.
Paul- Do you believe in
reincarnation? You have an interest in
Tibetan Buddhism which believes in
reincarnation.
Leonora- Yes, I find it interesting,

but I couldn't say at what point the
conscious personality outlives death.
We only need to sleep to convert
ourselves into different personalities.
That is why I think that talking about
reflexive consciousness, perception,
or the conscious- that in saying it, we
better express the idea. In our dreams
we conserve a certain degree of
consciousness, but we are not
conscious of what we call out, or
what things can be called, the

physical three dimensional world.

Right now you could visualize for
example, a rabbit, but obviously it
would not be a three dimensional
rabbit. Like I said, perhaps
reincarnation exists, but I think we
could reincarnate in different entities.
We could for example reincarnate
into an ant farm, full of ants. Do you
understand? The Tibetans say that the
best thing is to be human. In my
opinion, as humans, our attitude
makes the rest animals. We being
human animals is very mistaken. We
have adopted a totally false attitude in
believing we are superior to the other
animals, that we have rights over
them. In my opinion, the animal
world is universal and will continue
unexplored. We have no idea about

the capacity, consciousness or the

intelligence which animals possess.
Take for example the snout of a dog,
in it we will find ample language, and
the capacity to identify thousands of
things solely by its sense of smell.
Paul- Do animals have a spirit?
Leonora- Of course, everything, the

trees, the rocks, everything has life.
The earth is alive and everything has
consciousness/awareness. I am sure
that moreover, many Gods exist.
There probably exist Gods of the
informatica. For example, now
instead of insulting someone you
insult the one that ordained them. The
other day I went to the bank, and
there was a man who was furious with

one of the employees for not doing as

he asked for. But he didn't call him an
idiot, he said that his boss was an
idiot. He was probably imposing the
new style of insulting someone.
Leonora- I was born in North

England in South Lancaster. My
Grandfather invented a loom which
was to him more effective than the
rest. He dedicated himself to
inventing, he later married Miss Wild
de Derbyshire, who was in a better
position than him.
Paul- But the name Carrington is

somehow connected to the
aristocracy. Is that not so?
Leonora- No not our name. My

Mother was prone to fantasize about

her name. In the same manner she
would say that we were related to the
King Malcolm who previously lived
in Etelredo el Rojo which means that
they probably had to rectify it until
the next century. After my mother
died I had an interesting conversation
with my Uncle Gerald, now dead,
who told me that the Moorehead
(Mother's family name) were
probably gypsies, handy men. My
Grandfather's surname was fallible
because of what my mother invented.
She believed that she should have
been called "Usher- Summers" that
would have been the real aristocratic
name; what this signifies is that it did
not really interest her to introduce
herself as "Tinker" in the North of

England.
Paul- Were you the only daughter?
Leonora- Yes and I have three

brothers. The eldest Pat, then me, then
Gerald and Arthur. My parents first
lived in a house called Westwood and
then in another called Crooksey. They
would often change houses.
Paul- When did you start to paint?
Leonora- I started like most children.

Immediately, as soon as I could
scribble on the walls. Everyone has
scribbled. My Mother painted murals,
or something resembling murals,
which she would raffle. They looked
like Joan Miro's work. I drew horses,

not many did, but I dedicated myself

to them. I loved it.
Paul- How was your education?
Leonora- I would have been eight or

nine when I was sent to college, The
Holy Sepulchre, which was a convent
in Chelmsford, Essex, you know,
where Oscar Wilde was goaled. I was
there for a year. They told me I was
not willing to participate in the
games, nor in the school work. I was
advised to leave. They said my
vocation might lie in being a Saint.
I've probably exaggerated a little.
Paul- How is that?
Leonora- What I was most interested

in was the idea of Cheviter. I was sent

to the convent of St. Mary in Ascot. I

hated it. I was only there a year. Once
again they said I was not participating
so my family had me at home for a
while. My Mother would scold me, in
her quest to find a manner in which to
civilize her daughter. So I was sent to
Florence, when I was thirteen or
fourteen, to the College of Miss
Penrose in the Piazza Donatello. Later
I had appendicitis and I was operated
on in Berna. I was fourteen or fifteen
when I returned to England. I was
sent to Paris where I was expelled
from a strict finishing school. I only
lasted there for a few months and,
once again I was sent home. My
Father decided I was to be sent to
very strict place, there was an
American woman in Paris who had

such a place, a Miss Simpson. She

had a spare room with a patio which
looked out on to a church and
cemetery. I hated it, and one night I
escaped.
Paul- For how long?
Leonora- For nearly a month.
Paul- Your stay at the colleges were

getting shorter.
Leonora- Yes, I had lots of

experiences. I went to the house of a
family whom, I did not know, only
heard about. They had a vague idea of
who I was, I'm not sure how they
knew about me, some friend of the
family I suppose. The Simons. Mr.

Simon was a professor of Art.
I went to their house and was

instantly accepted. I did not tell them
I was unhappy in the place where I
had been sent. Only God knows why
they allowed me to stay in their home.
I continued painting and drawing. I
remained with them until they
presented me before the court. The
last court of George V, where I was to
be presented for marriage. Dressing
up for a big party at Buckingham
Palace. Oh, what it was like to be a
woman in those times- not allowed to
enter the paddock where they trained
the horses.
So I took a book to read, what else

could I do? The book was Eyeless in

Gaza by Huxley. I was sent back to

North England where I announced to
my family that I was going to be an
artist. After doing all those absurd
things the moment arrived when I was
going to do what I wanted. My Father
said I could remain at home where I
would have the space I wanted to
paint. With some help along the way I
went to Chelsea School of Art. I
attended the classes of Amedee
Ozenfant in a converted garage in
West Kensington. Ozenfant worked
me like a mule, he was a purist. He
did the following: you had to
understand the chemistry of
everything you used, including the
paper and the pencils. He gave us an
apple, a piece of paper and a 9H
pencil. With this we had to do a linear

sketch. He said he did not want to see

the shell of an apple, it was an apple
which had to be done with one single
outline. I spent six months drawing
the same apple which finally became
a kind of mummy. He was a good
professor with a clinical eye and he
never left you disheartened.
Paul- Were there many students?
Leonora- Among them was Ursula

Goldfinger. Erno Goldfinger was a
Hungarian revolutionary architect but
Ursula was from the Blackwell
family, of 'Cross and Blackwell'- the
marmalade. She was charming, and it
was she who invited me to a dinner
party where I met Max Ernst. It was
just the three of us. Max had an

exhibition in a London gallery. This

occurred after the grand Surrealist
exhibition. I already knew who Max
was, my Mother gave me a book on
Surrealism by Herbert Read for
Christmas. It was Max's work in the
book Deux enfants menaces par un
rossignol, which made a great
impression on me. Ursula knew that
Max preferred the company of a
young art student to that of an old
intellectual, so he could tell foolish
stories and enjoy himself.
Paul- You had already begun your

relationship?
Leonora- Immediately. I remember

we spent a day in the country where
he taught me frottage with leaves. We

were invited to Cornwall where we

spent a marvellous two weeks.
Meanwhile Hitler was converting
threats, I was beginning to be
informed as to who Hitler really was.
Really, Hitler was no boy scout!
(Winter in London again) I received

an insulting letter from my supposed
guardian, Serge Chermayeff, who
called me a whore. I stayed a week in
his house in Sussex where he told me
that I was a "cheap slut". But I told
him "cheap slut" or not, that's the way
things are, what do you want me to do
Serge? I was seventeen or eighteen
when I transferred to Paris. I was with
the Surrealists. They would meet in a
cafe in St. Germain-des-Pres. Hitler
was the main topic.

Paul- They put Max in a

concentration camp when war was
declared between France and
Germany. As a German citizen, Max,
was held by the French.
Leonora- They released him, and

then once again took him into custody
along with all the German citizens in
the Marseilles area. I was allowed to
see him once, but only for two
minutes. The Germans seemed to be
getting closer so Michel Lukacs, his
girlfriend Catherine and I decided to
escape. The only way out was through
the South. We went to Perpnian and
then to Andorra where my Father
shipped us to a mysterious Jesuit who
got us through to Spain. My Father
wanted me back in England, but I did

not go because I wanted to free Max.

I thought he was still in the French
concentration camp, it terrified me
that the Germans were approaching
because it would have meant the end.
Paul- For Max?
Leonora- And also for me, probably.

Anyway, Catherine and I continued
with the Jesuit who took us to Seo de
Urgel in the city Cataluna, from there
we went by car to Barcelona. We
intended to enter Portugal- but I wrote
about this in Down Below. I met up
with Renato Leduc (a friend from
Paris) in Madrid. He was a friend of
Picasso's.
Paul- After a few months of being in

Santader, when did you have your

nervous breakdown?
Leonora-After leaving the asylum, I

was always accompanied by a nurse. I
told her I was going to the toilet and
left her sitting in a coffee shop. I
caught a taxi to the Mexican
Embassy. Renato and I were married
before embarking to America.
Paul- You liked Renato, but you were

not in love with him?
Leonora- Yes, more or less.
Paul- Were you still worried about

Max?
Leonora- No, he was in Portugal

with Peggy Guggenheim so there was

no need to worry.
Paul- Did you feel confused?
Leonora- Yes, the situation was so

ambiguous, everything was like an
historical comedy, so absurd like a
soap opera.
Paul- Did you end the marriage?
Leonora- It was the only way out of

there.
Paul- So if Max could leave, why

was he with Peggy, an American?
Leonora- Who could blame them for

that?

Paul- Did you go to New York by

ship?
Leonora- Renato was working for the

Mexican Embassy. In Mexico I was
in close contact with the Surrealists. I
saw a lot of Breton, Bunuel and
Masson was also there. The whole
world - Chagall, Ozenfant (who I saw
fleetingly) and Duchamp, who was at
that time living with Max and Peggy.
They had a grand mansion by the
river in Sutton Place, where all the
diplomats lived. Everyone gathered at
Peggy's, she was very generous,
always having parties. But Renato
was fed up and he went to New York.
He was a poet, but really it was
Mexican politics that interested him.

Paul- Did you write or paint in those

times?
Leonora- I did both all the time.

Renato and I were together three
years and then I met Chiqui, and
Renato and I were separated. Renato
was a very decent person, but we had
different interests, different lives.
Chiqui Weisz was a friend of
Remedios Varo and Benjamin Peret.
They came from France with Breton.
Remedios had been in Paris and
Marseilles. He was half Andalusian
and half Catalan. In fact Chiqui and I
lived together with Remedios and
Benjamin when I abandoned Renato.
Renato took it very well.
Paul- Who else, amongst the

Surrealists, was in Mexico?
Leonora- There was Pierre Mabille,

who encouraged me to write Down
Below. There was also Remedios,
Peret, Octavio Paz, Diego Rivera, and
for a little while, Frida Kahlo. Diego
and I would every now and then see
Orozco. Diego and Frida got
remarried and I helped with the
wedding. It was a huge party. I had a
long conversation with Diego who
told me a lot of gossip. He was very
animated, he was a lot of fun, full of
life, exuberant. But Frida was going
through a rough patch, she was
becoming seriously ill so I barely saw
her.
Paul- You were in Mexico at a time

when great anthropological

discoveries were being realised.
Leonora- Yes, I believe it was Bernal

who began his excavations- Ignacio
Bernal, the director of the Institute of
Anthropology, who had one of my
paintings. He was a pleasant man with
a good relationship with his whole
family. We visited a lot of ruins. The
Mexican culture made a totally
unexpected impression on me, with
all its horror. There was a Goddess of
Death, Cautlicue. Huitzilopochtli -
God of War, a part of a series of
demonic creatures, similar to those
you see on children's television
programs these days. Those things
always scared me. In a spiritual way it
reminded me of an aspect of H. P.

Lovecraft. There was always a lot of

blood and something pressing and
threatening. I always feel depressed
by some aspects. There had been so
many human sacrifices, if we
compare them to the wars that we
have suffered, we will see that they
outnumbered the amount of deaths in
the last world war. During my time in
Mexico I was dreadfully frightened, it
was a physical way of killing which
was horrible. There was also a myth
about Quetzalcoatli. Peret was very
involved in this theme. I believe he
negotiated to acquire several pre-
Colombian pieces, which in those
days were easy to find. I disliked the
idea of having them in my house.
Paul- Some art critics believe that

your first stage was very Surrealistic,

but when you reached Mexico your
work developed a more personal
style.
Leonora- I don't know, even though I

was in contact with Remedios, I did
not have much of a relationship with
the more 'kosher' Surrealists.
Paul- Yours and Varo's work have

common elements. Did you work
together to develop a common style?
Leonora- No, not really. When I first

met Remedios she was painting in an
abstract style, similar to the Cubists.
Paul- So in a way she imitated you?

Leonora- More or less, but I was

moving towards a more cunning way,

which was influenced by a lot of
different things.
Leonora- Remedios and Peret had a

Spanish friend called Esteban
Frances. Esteban brought the English
collector Edward James to my house.
He was one of the first to buy my
paintings. He had a large collection of
Dali's and Picasso's. But a long time
passed before a Mexican gallery
accepted me. My fist exhibition in
Mexico was at a furniture shop.
It was before 1947, I remember

because Edward organized a show for
me in Pierre Matisse's gallery in New
York. During its inaugural I was in
hospital giving the first light (birth) to

Pablo, who was born in 1947.
Paul- Did motherhood influence your

art?
Leonora- I am not sure, but it

certainly was a grand commotion. I
had no idea what maternal instinct
was until I had my children.
After the Matisse gallery show, the

critics mentioned me. Inez Amor, the
owner of a gallery took an interest in
me thanks to the press, and she
provided a lot of publicity for me.
Paul- What drove you to write The

Hearing Trumpet? It is practically the
longest novel that you have written.
Leonora- I wrote it to enjoy myself.

Remedios and I would set out to write

different things together. I would
write the title and I would not tell her
what it was about, and she would
write the following. When we had
five chapters we would put them
together, we had a lot of fun. But in
the case of The Hearing Trumpet, I
simply sat down and wrote it. I set it
in the 1950s when I was around forty.
I typed it myself on a Remington. A
friend of mine, Albert Lewin, a film
director, intended on publishing it in
New York, but no one was interested
in the theme. Finally, Henri Parisot
wrote to me from Paris to ask if I had
anything.
Paul- You have always been

associated with the eccentrics of

Surrealism, with the esoteric and the

occult. I would like to know the
origins of your way of thinking.
Leonora- From a young age, and I

believe this happened to many people,
I used to have very strange
experiences with all sorts of ghosts,
visions and other things that were
generally condemned by Orthodox
Christianity.
Paul- Before getting to know

Orthodoxy?
Leonora- Yes, my first inexplicable

experiences began when I was two.
I've had it all my life. So I couldn't
tell you whether it was taught to me
through my Catholic education, or

whether we were told many ghost

stories, who knows? Perhaps from an
early age we were in contact with
Celtic Mythology. The Celtic and
Irish are known to what we call the
'gentry'; faeries, the giants, ghosts,
elves, gnomes. . . so I couldn't tell you
for certain why I have this mentality,
it just came naturally to me.
Paul- You have also been frequently

associated with diverse esoteric sects
and with the people in these sects.
Have you ever participated. . .
Leonora- No, never. No sect has

convinced me, nor any religion. The
closest thing that came to convincing
me was Tibetan Buddhism. In this
religion one followed practices that

were intellectually satisfying, and in

another way their beliefs are
extraordinary. But I have always
remained on the frontier of this sort of
thing. I was always interested in
discovering something that
corresponded to my experiences. That
is what I was really doing, I was
comparing it to what I knew inside.
Jungian theories also interested me. I
knew of Jung before the war, he was
someone the Surrealists were
interested in.
Paul- You seem very isolated from

women and the Women's Movement.
Leonora- Only because I think that

women have been oppressed and I do
not think many women have

developed their potential because they

were considered inferior. But that is
not to say that women are better than
men, or vice versa. What is clear is
that the principal preoccupation of the
oppressors is not to let women be.
Paul- You know of the saying that all

the great Surrealist artists were men,
and the women were ignored.
Leonora- They had on masks, the

mask of a Muse, so you had to bear
this muse even if it was crazily
allocated. They all believed that that
was the way it goes, and women
accepted that. But, to tell you the
truth, there were not that many good
artists, male or female.

Paul- Culturally speaking, it seems

that the work of Frida, Remedios and
yourself was developing. . .
Leonora- . . . outside the Surrealist

circuit. It is true; for example Frida,
who barely had any contact at all with
the Surrealists, with the exception of
her time in Paris, was very isolated.
She worked alone in Mexico. The
same goes for Remedios and myself.
Paul- Who do you admire?
Leonora- I admire many people. Of

course Max, and I admire painters. I
really like Frida's work, I think she
was a great artist. Are you referring to
artists?

Paul- No, not only artists, others.
Leonora- In my opinion it is not

good to completely admire anyone,
including God, because in doing so
you exclude the darker facets of being
human which are important not to
despise. If God does exist- then that
God must have a dark side just like
humans. People are partly white and
partly black. So how could I admire
someone? You must always have
reserve, and one must always have
time for oneself. It is not good to give
yourself totally to someone else, give
all you psyche away. You have to
save something for yourself, and this
space is always present.


Leonora Carrington
Pour Leonora Carrington, le

mouvement surréaliste a offert des
occasions pour vraiment s'exprimer.
Pendant son enfance, Leonora habitait
avec sa famille en Angleterre qui était
très stricte et riche. Elle a récu une
éducation par des gouvernantes, des
précepteurs, et des écoles de couvent.
Elle était expulsée quelque fois de
mauvaises comportements et une
attitude très rebelle. Elle écrivait dans
les miroirs de son école en disant son
haine pour l'église catholique et sa
famille. Sa famille lui a envoyée à un
internat à Florence où elle a appris à
peindre et où elle a goûté la liberté
pour la première fois. Sa décision de
devenir artiste était mal récue par sa

famille mais elle lui a permis d'étudier

l'art à Londres avec Amedée
Ozenfant. Ozenfant a enseigné l'art
avec un style très stricte qui ont suivi
des règles geometriques. Carrington,
au contraire, n'a pas suivi son maître
et donc ses peintures n'a pas
ressemblé à celles d'Ozenfant.
Carrington a adoré son esprit rebelle

pendant les années 1920's. On peut
voir dans son peinture qui s'appelle
"Portrait de Joan Powell" qu'elle a
laissé son passé rigide avec sa famille
pour une vie plus liberée. Voilà une
femme dans cette peinture qui est très
independante, un peu comme une
brute avec une cigarette qui tombe de
sa bouche. C'est une image d'une
femme qui est en train de se révolter.

Elle tient aussi un livre qui s'appelle

"Les Enfants Terribles"; cela est très
semblable à sa propre enfance.
Les premières peintures de Carrington

ont des images et des thèmes qui
viennent de son enfance. Son enfance
était plein de contes de fées et
d'histoires qui viennent de la Bible et
donc on peut insinuer que ses
peintures ont beaucoup d'imagination.
Ses peintures qui sont pleines
d'animaux, comme des oiseaux,
créent un décor très mystéreux
comme un rêve ou un fantasme.
Quelques ans plus tard, Carrington
s'est marié avec Max Ernst qui était
un artiste qui a participé au
mouvement surréaliste. Leur vie
ensemble a donné beaucoup de

puissance à son association à la nature

dans ses peintures.
Pendant cette partie de sa vie, ses

peintures reflètent des animaux
magiques comme l'image "du cheval
blanc". On peut voir cette image dans
sa peinture qui s'appelle "Self
Portrait".
Des animaux entourent la peinture et

la femme, qui s'assied sur la chaise,
est vraiment Leonora Carrington. Les
yeux de la femme brûlent et ses
cheveux poussent de sa tête comme la
crinière d'un cheval. C'est comme si
elle veut associer les humains avec les
animaux pour créer un nouveau
monde. Carrington utilise une hyène,
un animal nocturne qui appartient au

monde du rêve, et un cheval blanc à

bascule qui est son image la plus
importante et la plus personnelle.
Quand Leonora Carrington était
petite, elle a cultivé un rapport
imaginaire avec un cheval à bascule
dans une école maternelle. Dans "Self
Portrait", il y a un contraste très
important entre les deux animaux.
L'hyène noire et le cheval blanc
représente le positif contre le negatif
ou plus spécifiquement, la vie contre
la mort.
Les animaux de Carrington sont

identifiés aux forces de la nature.
L'hyène appartient au monde du soir,
et le cheval blanc devient une image
du jour et du monde imaginaire. Les
animaux sont très symbolique car ils

sont des intermédiares entre

l'inconscient et le monde de la nature.
Ils suggérent que la nature est la
source du pouvoir créateur pour les
femmes artistes. Carrington suggére
aussi une nouvelle définition pour
l'image de la "femme-enfant" qui était
définit par les hommes surréalistes.
Ils ont nommé les femmes "la femme
enfant" car ils ont cru que les femmes
étaient très innocentes, très
seductrices et dépendant sur l'homme.
Carrington, au contraire, a changé
cette définition en disant que la
femme-enfant veut dire que la femme,
à travers son rapport intime avec le
monde d'un enfant-le monde où il y a
de la fantasie, du rêve, du magique-
peut exprimer ses pensées à
l'intérieur. Donc selon sa définition, la

femme est capable de créer avec la

puissance mentale et pas seulement
avec la puissance sexuelle comme les
hommes.
En 1944, Carrington a publié "Down

Below" qui contient les experiences
de Carrington quand elle a fait une
dépression. C'est l'histoire de
l'écroulement de son monde et d'elle
même. "I begin therefore with the
moment when Max was taken away
to a concentration camp...I wept for
several hours, down in the village;
then I went up again to my house
where, for twenty-four hours, I
indulged in voluntary vomitings
induced by drinking orange blossom
water and interrupted by a short nap. I
hoped that my sorrow would be

allayed by those violent spasms

which tore my stomach apart like so
many earthquakes...I had realized the
injustice of society...My stomach was
the seat of that society, but also the
place in which I was united with all
the elements of the earth. It was...the
mirror of the earth, the reflection of
which is just as real as the person
reflected".
Depuis trois semaines, elle n'a pas

mangé. Elle était choquée
emotionnellement puisque son monde
familier n'a plus existé. Sa dernière
dépression nerveuse s'est passée à
Madrid où elle a menacé l'ambassade
britannique qu'elle allait tuer Hitler et
qu'elle allait libérer l'humanité. On l'a
mise en asile et son emprisonnement

est plein d'images violentes, "they

tore my clothes off brutally and
strapped me naked to the bed
accompanied by intense pain and
vivid hallucinations". Elle s'est
échappée des confinements de l'asile
et après quelques semaines, elle a
rencontré Renato LeDuc et s'est
mariée avec lui.
Leonora Carrington a utilisé ses

experiences personnelle comme son
enfance, sa vie avec Max Ernst, et sa
dépression, pour créer des peintures
pleines de choses magiques avec un
symbolisme très personnel. Avec
l'usage de son imagination, elle a
établi des relations profondes entre
ses experiences et la nature. On peut
voir dans ses peintures que Leonora

Carrington était toujours sur un

voyage très magique.

Opuscoli 5

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Opuscoli 5

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Paul De Angelis

Gli opuscoli di Omar Wisyam

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 2

Nunca me considere una “femme - enfant”

Paul De Angelis - What worries you

Leonora Carrington - Above all, the

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 3

Paul- Worlds more there than life?

Leonora- Yes, we distinguish life

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 4

asleep; with our bodies we do things,

Leonora- Yes, I find it interesting,

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 5

physical three dimensional world.

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 6

the capacity, consciousness or the

Paul- Do animals have a spirit?

Leonora- Of course, everything, the

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 7

one of the employees for not doing as

Leonora- I was born in North

Paul- But the name Carrington is

Leonora- No not our name. My

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 8

Mother was prone to fantasize about

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 9

Paul- Were you the only daughter?

Leonora- Yes and I have three

Paul- When did you start to paint?

Leonora- I started like most children.

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 10

not many did, but I dedicated myself

Leonora- I would have been eight or

Paul- How is that?

Leonora- What I was most interested

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 11

to the convent of St. Mary in Ascot. I

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 12

such a place, a Miss Simpson. She

Paul- For how long?

Leonora- For nearly a month.

Paul- Your stay at the colleges were

Leonora- Yes, I had lots of

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 13

Simon was a professor of Art.

I went to their house and was

So I took a book to read, what else

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 14

Gaza by Huxley. I was sent back to

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 15

sketch. He said he did not want to see

Paul- Were there many students?

Leonora- Among them was Ursula

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 16

exhibition in a London gallery. This

Paul- You had already begun your

Leonora- Immediately. I remember

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 17

were invited to Cornwall where we

(Winter in London again) I received

De Angelis - Carrington Pagina 18

Paul- They put Max in a

Leonora- They released him, and